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Cingular billing practices
|
|
| Robert A. Fink, M. D. 2007-01-28, 10:33 pm |
| I have been a long-time subscriber to Cingular and its predecessors
(Cellular One, then ATT Wireless, now Cingular, and soon back to ATT)
and, in general, I have been satisfied with the service. I recently
signed up with Cingular's Laptop Connect service as well and that has
also served me well. I also use AT&T for my long-distance and local
telephone service.
My current complaint with Cingular is its billing policy. I get an
electronic statement (via e-mail), which gives a payment due date
about 3 weeks later than the statement, and then, about 10 days later,
I receive a hard-copy bill which lists a due date about 2 weeks later
(but the mailed copy does not reach me until less than a week before
the due date). Then, almost exactly on the due date, I receive
another hard copy "dun notice" stating that my payment is late! Thus,
from the day on which I receive the first written bill, I have about
2.5 weeks to pay the bill without getting a "late notice". This seems
a bit "bush league" for someone who has an excellent credit history
(many years).
Is it too much to expect that one can expect to pay a bill within 30
days of receipt of the bill and still be considered "on time"? I have
complained to Cingular and they have not responded. If this
continues, I will seriously consider switching carriers when my
current contract ends (less than a year).
Best,
Bob
Robert A. Fink, M. D., FACS, P. C.
Neurological Surgery
2500 Milvia Street Suite 222
Berkeley, CA 94704-2636 USA
510-849-2555
"Ex Tristitia Virtus"
| |
| jeremy 2007-01-28, 10:33 pm |
| "Robert A. Fink, M. D." <lynxer@comcast.net> wrote in message
> I have complained to Cingular and they have not responded. If this
> continues, I will seriously consider switching carriers when my
> current contract ends (less than a year).
>
>
Millions of former Cingular customers have complained--to no avail. Don't
hold your breath waiting for satisfaction. Cingular has a well-documented
culture of contempt for its customers.
The best thing I ever did was to walk away from Cingular. And there are
millions of former AT&T customers that will tell you the same thing.
| |
| Elmo P. Shagnasty 2007-01-28, 10:33 pm |
| In article < 0j6qr2dk0rjnhggn54eq
jut3gtq57esfr5@4ax.com>,
"Robert A. Fink, M. D." <lynxer@comcast.net> wrote:
> I have been a long-time subscriber to Cingular and its predecessors
> (Cellular One, then ATT Wireless, now Cingular, and soon back to ATT)
> and, in general, I have been satisfied with the service. I recently
> signed up with Cingular's Laptop Connect service as well and that has
> also served me well. I also use AT&T for my long-distance and local
> telephone service.
How do you like the laptop connect? I'm thinking of something like
this, but frankly, I have the impression I'd rather do it with Verizon.
>
> My current complaint with Cingular is its billing policy. I get an
> electronic statement (via e-mail), which gives a payment due date
> about 3 weeks later than the statement, and then, about 10 days later,
> I receive a hard-copy bill which lists a due date about 2 weeks later
> (but the mailed copy does not reach me until less than a week before
> the due date). Then, almost exactly on the due date, I receive
> another hard copy "dun notice" stating that my payment is late! Thus,
> from the day on which I receive the first written bill, I have about
> 2.5 weeks to pay the bill without getting a "late notice". This seems
> a bit "bush league" for someone who has an excellent credit history
> (many years).
This isn't quite how it happened with me, in that I never got the dun
letter. But yeah, the paper statement seems to come shortly before the
bill is due.
You do realize, don't you, that Cingular wants you to go away from
having them generate and mail you paper statements?
This isn't so bad, really; their online statement system generates a
literal copy of your paper statement, such that YOU can print it out
yourself. Or not; I finally decided simply to save the electronic
statement locally as a simple PDF, ready for printing if need be. I
even use printouts of the first page, with the monthly bill amount, for
tax purposes. If someone really wants to see all the hoary detail, I
can pull it up.
>
> Is it too much to expect that one can expect to pay a bill within 30
> days of receipt of the bill and still be considered "on time"? I have
> complained to Cingular and they have not responded. If this
> continues, I will seriously consider switching carriers when my
> current contract ends (less than a year).
You won't get any response. Cingular et al. are the crack dealers, and
their main customers are the happy-go-lucky 20-something crowd who buy
lots of crack-like phone services and who simply pay whatever bill shows
up--or more likely, simply has that amount taken out of their bank
account. At any rate, they don't call Cingular, ever. Cingular likes
that. They would rather you be like that.
When a huge part of your business is continuously selling ring tones at
two bucks a pop to kids who have no concept of money, you tend to like
that and don't ever want to deal on a professional level with a
professional adult who has expectations of a business relationship.
And for the record: as much as Cingular would LIKE me to sign up for
auto-deduct, there's not a chance in hell I'm giving Cingular access to
my bank account or even credit card. I must review the bill first, take
care of any discrepancies with Cingular, and THEN pay them what *I*
think they are due.
No way are they going to generate some random bill and then take the
money from me, putting me in the position of begging them to give it
back to me.
I'm thinking of switching to Verizon simply because I think that they
have more mechanisms in place to deal with professional adults on a
professional level. They also plainly have superior phone service.
>
>
> Best,
>
> Bob
>
> Robert A. Fink, M. D., FACS, P. C.
> Neurological Surgery
> 2500 Milvia Street Suite 222
> Berkeley, CA 94704-2636 USA
> 510-849-2555
>
> "Ex Tristitia Virtus"
| |
| jeremy 2007-01-28, 10:33 pm |
| "Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in message news:elmop-
>
> You won't get any response. Cingular et al. are the crack dealers, and
> their main customers are the happy-go-lucky 20-something crowd who buy
> lots of crack-like phone services and who simply pay whatever bill shows
> up--or more likely, simply has that amount taken out of their bank
> account.
How is it that Third World countries have well-established cellular networks
and that residents who make only a fraction of what Americans make all seem
to have cell phones?
Why does it cost Americans $59.99 per month, just to be able to call home
and say they reached their destination in one piece, while people in poor
countries use their cell phones in place of landlines, and somehow manage to
pay for it?
| |
| Elmo P. Shagnasty 2007-01-28, 10:33 pm |
| In article <bUavh.1829$Pk5.403@trndny04>, "jeremy" <jeremy@nospam.com>
wrote:
> "Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in message news:elmop-
>
>
> How is it that Third World countries have well-established cellular networks
> and that residents who make only a fraction of what Americans make all seem
> to have cell phones?
We're backwards in this respect.
Of course, the third world countries had nothing UNTIL cellular became
available. It was too expensive to wire them up, but it's incredibly
easy to do cellular.
> Why does it cost Americans $59.99 per month, just to be able to call home
> and say they reached their destination in one piece, while people in poor
> countries use their cell phones in place of landlines, and somehow manage to
> pay for it?
We're backwards.
| |
| Kevin K 2007-01-28, 10:33 pm |
| On Sun, 28 Jan 2007 22:00:56 UTC, "Robert A. Fink, M. D."
<lynxer@comcast.net> wrote:
> I have been a long-time subscriber to Cingular and its predecessors
> (Cellular One, then ATT Wireless, now Cingular, and soon back to ATT)
> and, in general, I have been satisfied with the service. I recently
> signed up with Cingular's Laptop Connect service as well and that has
> also served me well. I also use AT&T for my long-distance and local
> telephone service.
>
> My current complaint with Cingular is its billing policy. I get an
> electronic statement (via e-mail), which gives a payment due date
> about 3 weeks later than the statement, and then, about 10 days later,
> I receive a hard-copy bill which lists a due date about 2 weeks later
> (but the mailed copy does not reach me until less than a week before
> the due date). Then, almost exactly on the due date, I receive
> another hard copy "dun notice" stating that my payment is late! Thus,
> from the day on which I receive the first written bill, I have about
> 2.5 weeks to pay the bill without getting a "late notice". This seems
> a bit "bush league" for someone who has an excellent credit history
> (many years).
>
> Is it too much to expect that one can expect to pay a bill within 30
> days of receipt of the bill and still be considered "on time"? I have
> complained to Cingular and they have not responded. If this
> continues, I will seriously consider switching carriers when my
> current contract ends (less than a year).
>
>
My solution has been to setup autopay to my credit card. My bill is
charged on the due date, then I have up to a month after that to pay
my credit card without interest charges.
The choice of going to a different provider that may or may not
provide as good of service but who will probably be similar in billing
is obviously your choice.
| |
| Elmo P. Shagnasty 2007-01-28, 10:33 pm |
| In article <KIRoJuEXw9g9-pn2- Z549Li7VdZvz@localho
st>,
"Kevin K" <kevink4@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> My solution has been to setup autopay to my credit card. My bill is
> charged on the due date, then I have up to a month after that to pay
> my credit card without interest charges.
And what happens when--not if, but when--Cingular XXXXs up big time and
you get an $8000 charge on your bill?
Better that you review the bill first and then go to their web site and
put it on your card. If the bill doesn't pass your review, no harm
done. You put the ball back in Cingular's court to get you a correct
bill.
| |
| Todd Allcock 2007-01-28, 10:33 pm |
| At 29 Jan 2007 00:06:31 +0000 jeremy wrote:
> How is it that Third World countries have well-established cellular
> networks
Many of those areas never saw landlines, and leapfrogged right to
wireless.
> and that residents who make only a fraction of what Americans make all
> seem to have cell phones?
Much of the world outside of North America has a "caller-pays" telephone
system. Incoming calls are free, and outgoing calls cost money, even
to/from landlines. Couple that system with prepaid mobile phones and you
can talk all you want- as long as you aren't _placing_ the calls...
> Why does it cost Americans $59.99 per month, just to be able to call
> home and say they reached their destination in one piece,
It doesn't cost Americans $59.99 to call home. It costs Americans $59.99
to chat on their mobiles for 16 hours a month not including the free
nights, free weekends or free on-network calling.
Americans COULD pay about $8/month to call home if they chose to- a
prepaid plan with Cingular or T-Mobile is $100/year, and offers 400-1000
minutes of use (depending on carrier.) 1000 minutes averages roughly
three minutes a day- certainly enough to say that got to your
destination in one piece.
Now, to put your sudden exclamation of "only THREE minutes a day? Are
you NUTS?" to rest, here's some context: my first cellphone plan (in 1990)
was $14.95/month for TEN minutes. Extra minutes were 75-cents each, IIRC.
Even with taxes, I never had a bill that exceeded $25 because I used the
phone sparingly.
Today my bill is $50, but that includes unlimited internet and more
minutes per month than I generally use in three months. If I could get a
reasonable unlimited mobile internet plan on prepaid, I'd switch to it in
a heartbeat.
> ...while people in poor
> countries use their cell phones in place of landlines, and somehow
> manage to pay for it?
In caller-pays countries, the burden of paying for mobile airtime falls
on those placing the call to the mobile, be it from another mobile or a
landline, and prepaid plans are common and competitive. Plus, anyone who
uses a mobile in place of the landline is already "ahead" the cost of the
landline. If the purpose of your phone is to be available in case you're
needed (i.e. if your boss needs to get ahold of you) you can have service
in a caller-pays country for just a few dollars a month.
| |
| Todd Allcock 2007-01-28, 10:33 pm |
| At 28 Jan 2007 21:24:06 -0500 Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
> And what happens when--not if, but when--Cingular XXXXs up big time and
> you get an $8000 charge on your bill?
Um, first you call Cingular and have them fix it, then call your credit
card company and put the charge in dispute? Disputed charge do not have
to be paid until they are investigated for their legitimacy. This buys
the time necessary for Cingular to remove the incorrect charge before you
have to pay it to avoid finance charges.
I was a Cingular customer for ten years (counting my tenure with SBMS
before they became Cingular.) I signed up for automatic bill payment the
day they started offering it. Sure, they messed up a few bills over those
years, but never by more than $10 or so. Bigger mistakes can happen, but
I wouldn't eschew the convenience of automatic bill payment because you
_might_ have a problem someday.
> Better that you review the bill first and then go to their web site and
> put it on your card. If the bill doesn't pass your review, no harm
> done. You put the ball back in Cingular's court to get you a correct
> bill.
Whatever works for you. Most of my current utilities e-mail me the
amount of (and/or a link to) my bill a week or more before they process
payment, so I get the best of both worlds- the convenience of autopay and
the chance to investigate a potential problem and correct it first.
| |
|
| On Jan 28, 2:00 pm, "Robert A. Fink, M. D." <lyn...@comcast.net>
wrote:
> My current complaint with Cingular is its billing policy. I get an
> electronic statement (via e-mail), which gives a payment due date
> about 3 weeks later than the statement
I don't know if you'll be able to get them to fix the discrepancy
between online and paper due dates. But if I remember correctly, they
give a pretty generous amount of time between end of billing cycle and
late fee date (which is different than due date). I would suggest
canceling paper billing, and just going by the online billing. Take a
close look to see when the actual late fee date is, which should be at
least 30 days since end of cycle. If the date that you receive an
email is much later that end of billing cycle, then you can use some
other system (like Yahoo Calendar) to send you a monthly reminder.
After the end of billing cycle, you will be able to log in to account
and pay the balance.
| |
| karlkrandall@sbcglobal.net 2007-01-29, 7:33 am |
| On Sun, 28 Jan 2007 17:49:57 -0500, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
<elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote:
>
>You do realize, don't you, that Cingular wants you to go away from
>having them generate and mail you paper statements?
They want your credit card number so they can have their money
instantly.
Good luck then if they charge you $31,000 for roaming long distance
from Central America...
http://www.delawareonline.com/apps/.../701280327/1003
| |
| karlkrandall@sbcglobal.net 2007-01-29, 7:33 am |
| On Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:24:06 -0500, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
<elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote:
>In article <KIRoJuEXw9g9-pn2- Z549Li7VdZvz@localho
st>,
> "Kevin K" <kevink4@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>And what happens when--not if, but when--Cingular XXXXs up big time and
>you get an $8000 charge on your bill?
>
>Better that you review the bill first and then go to their web site and
>put it on your card. If the bill doesn't pass your review, no harm
>done. You put the ball back in Cingular's court to get you a correct
>bill.
No, they'll cancel you first, as they did that poor retiree in
Florida.
http://www.delawareonline.com/apps/.../701280327/1003
| |
| jeremy 2007-01-29, 7:33 am |
|
< karlkrandall@sbcglob
al.net> wrote in message
news:8mqrr2du8rcbjcp
mve0fotqqaepfm77s08@
4ax.com...
> On Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:24:06 -0500, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
> <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> No, they'll cancel you first, as they did that poor retiree in
> Florida.
>
> http://www.delawareonline.com/apps/.../701280327/1003
They have a culture of contempt for their customers.
Why do people remain their customers?
| |
| Dale M. White 2007-01-29, 7:33 am |
| I guess I have it pretty good. My bill is pretty much static. every month
it's the same. But in regards to you, are you oppose to having to go on-line
and checling your bill ? Though it varies a little by each area, you know
that on the 18th of every month the billing period ends, so you could look
on the website on the 21st, know what you bill is and mail it in. Or as
suggested and as I do, setup Auto-pay and not worry about it. with Autopay,
they don't take the money out until the very last minute.So for me, the
billing cycle ends on the 18th and the payment is due on the 10th and they
normally deduct it out on the 9th or 10th. Plenty of time to review the bill
and get things corrected.
If nothing else, once you pay on-line (not using auto-pay) the next time you
go to pay it will ask if you want to use the same account to pay this bill.
Pretty fast and simple, so even if you get the paper bill a week before it's
due, you can still get it paid for in plenty of time.
Now if you're old fashion and prefer to write a check for everything and you
bill ranges all over the place, then you've got a tough row to hoe
"Robert A. Fink, M. D." <lynxer@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:0j6qr2dk0rjnhgg
n54eqjut3gtq57esfr5@
4ax.com...
>I have been a long-time subscriber to Cingular and its predecessors
> (Cellular One, then ATT Wireless, now Cingular, and soon back to ATT)
> and, in general, I have been satisfied with the service. I recently
> signed up with Cingular's Laptop Connect service as well and that has
> also served me well. I also use AT&T for my long-distance and local
> telephone service.
>
> My current complaint with Cingular is its billing policy. I get an
> electronic statement (via e-mail), which gives a payment due date
> about 3 weeks later than the statement, and then, about 10 days later,
> I receive a hard-copy bill which lists a due date about 2 weeks later
> (but the mailed copy does not reach me until less than a week before
> the due date). Then, almost exactly on the due date, I receive
> another hard copy "dun notice" stating that my payment is late! Thus,
> from the day on which I receive the first written bill, I have about
> 2.5 weeks to pay the bill without getting a "late notice". This seems
> a bit "bush league" for someone who has an excellent credit history
> (many years).
>
> Is it too much to expect that one can expect to pay a bill within 30
> days of receipt of the bill and still be considered "on time"? I have
> complained to Cingular and they have not responded. If this
> continues, I will seriously consider switching carriers when my
> current contract ends (less than a year).
>
>
> Best,
>
> Bob
>
> Robert A. Fink, M. D., FACS, P. C.
> Neurological Surgery
> 2500 Milvia Street Suite 222
> Berkeley, CA 94704-2636 USA
> 510-849-2555
>
> "Ex Tristitia Virtus"
| |
|
| jeremy wrote:
> They have a culture of contempt for their customers.
>
> Why do people remain their customers?
Cool fones, Dude!
| |
| Thurman 2007-01-29, 10:33 am |
|
"jeremy" <jeremy@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:_5mvh.19981$Mx4.7693@trndny07...
>
> They have a culture of contempt for their customers.
>
> Why do people remain their customers?
In that competitive business of cellular, marketing (products, services and
prices) has very definite marketing windows. If you are basing today's
decisions on what happened a year ago, I think you are in for
disappointment.
You have to reevaluate >at the time you are compelled to make a change<.
When I made a change in November, Cingular offered the best coverage for
voice AND data at very competitive prices. The same deal was gone in
December.
I've had Cingular as a service and support for 18 months with no complaints.
As a developer I probably squeeze 400% more variety out of a cell phone than
the average user. Depending on usage, I still recommend Cingular to clients.
| |
|
| In article < Y9SdnfpnrMsZaiDYnZ2d
nUVZ_hzinZ2d@comcast
.com>,
CC56 <copycat56@comcast.net> wrote:
> jeremy wrote:
>
>
> Cool fones, Dude!
Except for iPhone, Cingular has some of the worst phones.
--
To reply by email, remove the word "space"
| |
| jeremy 2007-01-29, 10:33 am |
|
"Thurman" <thurman@bigplanet.com> wrote in message
news:Gsovh.12$9x2.7@newsfe02.lga...
>
> "jeremy" <jeremy@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:_5mvh.19981$Mx4.7693@trndny07...
>
> In that competitive business of cellular, marketing (products, services
> and prices) has very definite marketing windows. If you are basing today's
> decisions on what happened a year ago, I think you are in for
> disappointment.
>
> You have to reevaluate >at the time you are compelled to make a change<.
>
> When I made a change in November, Cingular offered the best coverage for
> voice AND data at very competitive prices. The same deal was gone in
> December.
>
> I've had Cingular as a service and support for 18 months with no
> complaints. As a developer I probably squeeze 400% more variety out of a
> cell phone than the average user. Depending on usage, I still recommend
> Cingular to clients.
>
My view of Cingular will be forever colored by the way they treated former
ATTWS customers after the merger.
Tons of us left, rather than give in to Cingular's arm-twisting to make us
abandon our preferential rate plans (which we EARNED by being loyal ATTWS
customers for YEARS) and go with new two-year contracts at higher prices, as
though we were just a bunch of new customers that had just walked in the
door.
They even wanted me to pay a new account setup charge for each of my three
lines!
It is not the money, it is the cold, calculated "we've-got-you" approach
that most disgusted me. I just was not about to be pushed around, so I left
and now I'm happy with Sprint. For all I know, Cingular offers better
service, but I just cannot stand the feeling of having been exploited by
them.
Perhaps it's juvenile, but I was a good customer of ATTWS, and I paid them
on time like clockwork. I deserved a fairer shake than I got when Cingular
appeared on the scene. The attitudes expressed by their CSRs were awful.
And, judging from the article about what they put that retiree through in
Florida, they appear not to have changed. I'd rather do without cellular
service, rather than have to deal with Cingular. That is how bad an
impression they made on me. And, according to published reports, they had
the same effect on millions more former ATTWS customers, too.
| |
|
| In article <aepvh.4512$635.1296@trndny05>, "jeremy" <jeremy@nospam.com>
wrote:
> "Thurman" <thurman@bigplanet.com> wrote in message
> news:Gsovh.12$9x2.7@newsfe02.lga...
>
> My view of Cingular will be forever colored by the way they treated former
> ATTWS customers after the merger.
>
> Tons of us left, rather than give in to Cingular's arm-twisting to make us
> abandon our preferential rate plans (which we EARNED by being loyal ATTWS
> customers for YEARS) and go with new two-year contracts at higher prices, as
> though we were just a bunch of new customers that had just walked in the
> door.
>
> They even wanted me to pay a new account setup charge for each of my three
> lines!
>
> It is not the money, it is the cold, calculated "we've-got-you" approach
> that most disgusted me. I just was not about to be pushed around, so I left
> and now I'm happy with Sprint. For all I know, Cingular offers better
> service, but I just cannot stand the feeling of having been exploited by
> them.
>
> Perhaps it's juvenile, but I was a good customer of ATTWS, and I paid them
> on time like clockwork. I deserved a fairer shake than I got when Cingular
> appeared on the scene. The attitudes expressed by their CSRs were awful.
>
> And, judging from the article about what they put that retiree through in
> Florida, they appear not to have changed. I'd rather do without cellular
> service, rather than have to deal with Cingular. That is how bad an
> impression they made on me. And, according to published reports, they had
> the same effect on millions more former ATTWS customers, too.
No argument from me that takeover was the most abysmal ever for the
customer. I was just like you. Besides how they screwed up my account,
rates went up and the new phones were terrible.
Bottom line, there is no such thing as customer loyalty anymore. I knew
this as soon as Cingular took over and I wasn't expecting anything from
the puffing hype their PR firms spun about the merger.
You need to pick a company and plan knowing this full-well going in.
--
To reply by email, remove the word "space"
| |
| jeremy 2007-01-29, 3:33 pm |
| "Kurt" <labolide@spacegmail.com> wrote in message
news:labolide-683331.10051829012007@news.giganews.com...
>
> No argument from me that takeover was the most abysmal ever for the
> customer. I was just like you. Besides how they screwed up my account,
> rates went up and the new phones were terrible.
>
> Bottom line, there is no such thing as customer loyalty anymore. I knew
> this as soon as Cingular took over and I wasn't expecting anything from
> the puffing hype their PR firms spun about the merger.
>
> You need to pick a company and plan knowing this full-well going in.
>
> --
> To reply by email, remove the word "space"
I should have mentioned what it was about this deal that so infuriated me:
When the merger (it was NOT represented as a buyout) was announced, ATTWS,
in their customer magazine "Mmode," had a letter from the President of
ATTWS, assuring us that nothing was going to change. No one was going to
lose their rate plan. No one was going to be forced to switch to anything
they did not want.
ATTWS even phoned me and offered me a very nice package if I would go back
onto a 1-year contract (I had long been off-contract by then) to extend my
TDMA service. I took the deal. It was excellent, and I had no problems
while AT&T was still my provider.
Then Cingular took over, and suddenly my service became unreliable.
Suddenly it took up to 5 minutes before I could log onto a tower, once I
turned my phone on. Suddenly all three of my phones would mysteriously shut
themselves off as soon as I left my home area--something that had never
happened before. Cingular denied any responsibility, and tried to upsell me
into their higher rate GSM plans, and even to pay new activation fees on my
three lines.
Now, I know that TDMA was going to be decommissioned, but does anyone think
that ATTWS, had they remained the provider, would have taken away our
preferential rates, free M2M (that was an extra charge back in those days),
or would have demanded that we re-up for two years and pay activation fees
again?
Does anyone believe that ATTWS would have deliberately tightened the noose
by slowly and progressively restricting access to its towers, as a method of
coercing its TDMA customers to switch? I believe that they would have
announced a shut-off date and probably would have offered free or discounted
GSM phones--and I'd have been happy with that. At least they would not have
been coercing millions of customers.
So, I am angry over Cingular's failure to keep the promises that they and
ATTWS jointly made to us. I would never give Cingular a penny's worth of my
business again. They can keep on releasing news of increasing profits--but
I have the satisfaction of knowing that not one penny of those profits came
from me. Juvenile? Perhaps. But it is the only form of protest that is
available to me--that and the ability for me to continually post my story on
the Internet, to give a heads-up to other potential Cingular customers. I
know it won't put Cingular out of business, but it is my little way of
flipping them the bird.
Any other company that shed millions of customers--customers that they
purchased--would have seen some executive heads roll. Not Cingular. Very
strange. I have read that SBC Communications also had a reputation for
being ruthless and insensitive toward their customers. And I presume that
we'll be seeing the same lack of consideration from the new AT&T.
Contrast that with my experience with Sprint over the past year, since I
ported my numbers from Cingular. Like night vs. day. No problems with
service, friendly customer reps. Good rate plan. Crystal-clear call
quality. No arm-twisting. No setup charges. Free phones--three of them.
They even offered me free 7 PM N/W, which was offered about 2 weeks after I
signed up. Nice people, and I don't care what the industry surveys say.
Every single contact I had with Sprint has been positive, and I came away
from those calls feeling satisfied.
There is life after Cingular. But I still am amazed and puzzled over why
they would be that way. It flies against all the textbook "customer
service" recommendations. One would think that they were a monopoly, to get
away with that.
| |
| Edward Reid 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| On Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:24:06 -0500, Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
> And what happens when--not if, but when--Cingular XXXXs up big time and
> you get an $8000 charge on your bill?
I write the bank and tell them to reverse the charge. I'm confident that
when the bank weighs my word against Cingular's, I'll do well. There's a
reason that cell phone companies as a group rate pretty close to the bottom
of all industries in consumer approval. And it's a credit card -- I
definitely would not let them do a bank draft or debit card.
I've done OK with correcting Cingular billing errors ... as long as I
assume I'll have to call several times. Last year I got a $9.99/month cram
from mQube on my bill. Talked to several very nice CSRs over the next few
months. At least two of them looked hard enough to realize that I'd paid
the cram more times than even I had counted, and issued credits for all. At
least I think the last one succeeded ... still need another billing cycle
to check it.
> Better that you review the bill first and then go to their web site and
> put it on your card. If the bill doesn't pass your review, no harm
> done. You put the ball back in Cingular's court to get you a correct
> bill.
For me there's a real benefit in not having to worry about whether a bill
gets paid on time. If I get busy and don't want to deal with bills for a
while, I'm mostly safe. I still have to deal with the credit cards (not
willing to let them draft automatically), but otherwise I've pretty much
got all critical bills on autopay. I'd get the 1% card rebate either way,
but this way it's automatic. If you don't mind scheduling and checking
these things, then your way is a good one. People differ.
Edward
--
Art Works by Melynda Reid: http://paleo.org
| |
| Todd Allcock 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| At 29 Jan 2007 16:25:42 +0000 jeremy wrote:
> Tons of us left, rather than give in to Cingular's arm-twisting to make
us
> abandon our preferential rate plans (which we EARNED by being loyal
ATTWS
> customers for YEARS) and go with new two-year contracts at higher prices,
as
> though we were just a bunch of new customers that had just walked in
the
> door.
True, but did you ever think, perhaps, that was Cingular's plan? Before
the merger, AT&TWS was giving away the farm- unlimited GSM plans for $99,
amazing retention deals, etc.
Perhaps Cingular's intent all along was to strongarm you into paying more
or walking away. Frankly, they'd rather have a $15/month customer cancel
than keep his $15 plan. Billing and support costs are too high to allow
such low revenue customers.
So, in the end, both parties were happy- you, because you left Cingular,
and Cingular for cutting loose another lower revenue customer. I'm not
saying I _like_ the way they handled the merger, but I do understand it.
| |
| Robert A. Fink, M. D. 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| On Sun, 28 Jan 2007 17:49:57 -0500, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
<elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote:
>How do you like the laptop connect? I'm thinking of something like
>this, but frankly, I have the impression I'd rather do it with Verizon.
The laptop connect service is fairly good. I hear, however, that
Verizon may be better. If my annoyance with Cingular's billing
practices continue, I am considering switching to Verizon at the end
of my Cingular contract.
Best,
Bob
Robert A. Fink, M. D., FACS, P. C.
Neurological Surgery
2500 Milvia Street Suite 222
Berkeley, CA 94704-2636 USA
510-849-2555
"Ex Tristitia Virtus"
| |
| Robert A. Fink, M. D. 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| On Mon, 29 Jan 2007 08:31:06 -0500, "Dale M. White"
<dale.white@NOinsightbb.NOcom> wrote:
>Now if you're old fashion and prefer to write a check for everything and you
>bill ranges all over the place, then you've got a tough row to hoe
Yes, I am "old-fashioned", but this includes keeping control of my
payment practices and not giving access to my account away to a
provider of services. My bill does not vary that much (4 lines plus
Laptop Connect), but I strongly resent being manipulated by Cingular.
They are quite likely going to lose a customer soon.
Best,
Bob
Robert A. Fink, M. D.
Neurological Surgery
2500 Milvia Street Suite 222
Berkeley, CA 94704-2636 USA
510-849-2555
********************
**************
NOTE: The material above is not "medical
advice". Medical advice can only be
given after an in-person contact between
doctor and patient.
********************
**************
| |
| jeremy 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| "Todd Allcock" < elecconnec@AmericaOn
Line.com> wrote in message
news:epluev$57d$1@ai
oe.org...
>
> True, but did you ever think, perhaps, that was Cingular's plan? Before
> the merger, AT&TWS was giving away the farm- unlimited GSM plans for $99,
> amazing retention deals, etc.
>
> Perhaps Cingular's intent all along was to strongarm you into paying more
> or walking away. Frankly, they'd rather have a $15/month customer cancel
> than keep his $15 plan. Billing and support costs are too high to allow
> such low revenue customers.
>
> So, in the end, both parties were happy- you, because you left Cingular,
> and Cingular for cutting loose another lower revenue customer. I'm not
> saying I _like_ the way they handled the merger, but I do understand it.
>
>
I was paying $105.00/month for 3 phones. I wasn't anywhere near a $15.00
customer. But Cingular wanted me to sign up for 3 x $50, or 150.00/month
and I balked. I never used my anytime minutes, I mainly used M2M.
How could a customer like me be unprofitable? And why did we receive all
those assurances that nothing would change and no one would be forced into
another rate plan?
Oh, well, it takes all types to make a world. I cannot see what Cingular
gained from buying us up and then giving us the boot.
But the one factor that seems to remain unchanged is that they still look
down on their customers. Fortunately my needs are for voice only, so none
of Cingular's value-added services appeal to me. I can go to any carrier
and get what I require. Bells and whistles don't do anything for me.
Strange how Cingular thought I wasn't worth the bother, but Sprint welcomed
me with open arms. My only regret is that I put up with Cingular's tactics
for as long as I did. I stayed with them for more than a year after the
buyout. But I suppose that a lot of other ex-Cingular customers have
similar regrets, too.
| |
| Kevin K 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| On Mon, 29 Jan 2007 02:24:06 UTC, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
<elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote:
> And what happens when--not if, but when--Cingular XXXXs up big time and
> you get an $8000 charge on your bill?
>
For one thing, I have at least a few weeks from checking my bill to
when I'm charged. That would give me plenty of time to find out, and
escalate it to get it resolved. Even then, if I have problems, I
could dispute the charge.
--
| |
| Kevin K 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| On Mon, 29 Jan 2007 03:45:01 UTC, Todd Allcock
< elecconnec@AmericaOn
Line.com> wrote:
> Bigger mistakes can happen, but
> I wouldn't eschew the convenience of automatic bill payment because you
> _might_ have a problem someday.
>
I know people who refuse to sign up for direct deposit of paychecks,
because there "might" be a problem with getting the money in their
account on the correct day.
I think that, in 17 years of direct deposit, the worst has been the
time it showed up in the afternoon of payday.
As for also getting cash, I have an ATM card.
--
| |
| Kevin K 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| On Mon, 29 Jan 2007 18:05:18 UTC, Kurt <labolide@spacegmail.com>
wrote:
> No argument from me that takeover was the most abysmal ever for the
> customer. I was just like you. Besides how they screwed up my account,
> rates went up and the new phones were terrible.
>
In my case, things were an improvement. I went from a TDMA regional
plan for $25 or so a month and 100 minutes to a Sprint phone with
unusable service at home (and a big hassle to even get service) to
Cingular for only a couple dollars more a month than Sprint with 250
anytime minutes. Phone $5/month less, data $5/month more than Sprint.
--
| |
| jeremy 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
|
"Kevin K" <kevink4@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:KIRoJuEXw9g9-pn2- zFCCL6LSNwnG@localho
st...
> On Mon, 29 Jan 2007 18:05:18 UTC, Kurt <labolide@spacegmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> In my case, things were an improvement. I went from a TDMA regional
> plan for $25 or so a month and 100 minutes to a Sprint phone with
> unusable service at home (and a big hassle to even get service) to
> Cingular for only a couple dollars more a month than Sprint with 250
> anytime minutes. Phone $5/month less, data $5/month more than Sprint.
>
> --
>
I'm sure that Cingular has its boosters. I just don't happen to be one of
them.
But let's not confuse two dissimilar issues--that of non-availability of
signal with a culture of contempt for customers.
If service availability were not an issue, I'd choose Sprint if only because
they exhibited a sincere desire to get, and retain, me as a customer, unlike
Cingular. And, in my situation, the signal strength and coverage is better
than either ATTWS or Cingular was, so it all worked out for me.
| |
| Elmo P. Shagnasty 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| In article <KIRoJuEXw9g9-pn2- qV0ekf5OJ25R@localho
st>,
"Kevin K" <kevink4@gmail.com> wrote:
> I know people who refuse to sign up for direct deposit of paychecks,
> because there "might" be a problem with getting the money in their
> account on the correct day.
Oh, you can put money into my account all you want.
If there'll be a screwup getting the money in, there'll also be a
screwup getting me my check.
But give an abusive company like Cingular carte blanche to take money
AWAY from me? And put me in the position of having to chase them down
while they claim that "the bill is proper, and you owe the money"?
At least with my employer, there is absolutely zero chance of them
successfully claiming that they didn't owe me the money. But with
Cingular, they'll take their money and deny that they have any
obligation to give it back, no matter what.
| |
| Elmo P. Shagnasty 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| In article <j312vzhotfb1.1q8tra887la9w$.dlg@40tude.net>,
Edward Reid <edward@paleoNOTTHIS.org.NOTTHIS> wrote:
>
> I write the bank and tell them to reverse the charge. I'm confident that
> when the bank weighs my word against Cingular's, I'll do well.
You have way, WAY more confidence in that particular system than do I.
You'd better hope you never have the opportunity to test that theory.
> I've done OK with correcting Cingular billing errors ... as long as I
> assume I'll have to call several times.
Pretty much.
Cingular has a track record with me of sending bills that have
apparently random amounts on them. I'm sure they're just trolling,
looking to collect whatever amount manages to come in. If they put a
random amount on the bill, chances are excellent that said random amount
will be paid--because as a whole, cell phone customers do NOT pay any
attention to their bills. They just pay whatever it says and move on.
Either it's stupid kids who live their lives that way, or busy adults
who figure it's close enough.
They accept that people like me will call them on it, but the rate of
that happening is low.
| |
| John Navas 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| On Mon, 29 Jan 2007 12:52:10 GMT, "jeremy" <jeremy@nospam.com> wrote in
<_5mvh.19981$Mx4.7693@trndny07>:
>They have a culture of contempt for their customers.
Nonsense.
>Why do people remain their customers?
Fits my needs better than any other carrier.
--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/ Cingu...less_FA
Q>
| |
| John Navas 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| On Mon, 29 Jan 2007 08:00:32 -0800, Kurt <labolide@spacegmail.com> wrote
in <labolide-E49A30.08003229012007@news.giganews.com>:
>In article < Y9SdnfpnrMsZaiDYnZ2d
nUVZ_hzinZ2d@comcast
.com>,
> CC56 <copycat56@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>Except for iPhone, Cingular has some of the worst phones.
And some very good ones, including Motorola L6, RAZR & KRZR, Samsung
Blackjack, Sony Ericsson Z525a & W810i, Nokia 6030 & E62, BlackBerry
Pearl & 7290, Cingular 8525, Palm Treo 650, 680 & 750.
--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/ Cingu...less_FA
Q>
| |
| John Navas 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| On Mon, 29 Jan 2007 19:14:43 GMT, "jeremy" <jeremy@nospam.com> wrote in
<DIrvh.3102$li4.205@trndny08>:
>I should have mentioned what it was about this deal that so infuriated me:
No thanks. We've heard it all before, over and over. Please give it a
rest, grow up, and stop trolling here.
--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/ Cingu...less_FA
Q>
| |
| John Navas 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| On Tue, 30 Jan 2007 01:18:53 GMT, "jeremy" <jeremy@nospam.com> wrote in
<12xvh.4398$Pk5.1498@trndny04>:
>But let's not confuse two dissimilar issues--that of non-availability of
>signal with a culture of contempt for customers.
Nonsense.
--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/ Cingu...less_FA
Q>
| |
| jeremy 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| "Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in message news:elmop-
>
> But give an abusive company like Cingular carte blanche to take money
> AWAY from me? And put me in the position of having to chase them down
> while they claim that "the bill is proper, and you owe the money"?
>
Most people would be reluctant to give the proverbial keys to their bank
accounts to anyone.
Even honest mistakes result in many hours of scrambling in order to correct
the errors. Meanwhile, the customer does not have the use of his money.
Not all banks will credit back errors, as ACH transactions, unlike credit
cards, do not have federal requirements that protect the consumer. Banks
may or may not have policies that mirror credit card regulations.
I personally use my bank's online bill payment service, where I authorize
the date and amount of each payment and where the recipient of the funds has
no ability to take money out of my account.
Anyone who hands over power to recipients to remove money from their
accounts is assuming a lot of risk. There are safer methods of paying one's
bills.
| |
| John Navas 2007-01-29, 10:33 pm |
| On Tue, 30 Jan 2007 03:17:47 GMT, "jeremy" <jeremy@nospam.com> wrote in
<vNyvh.5500$635.833@trndny05>:
>Even honest mistakes result in many hours of scrambling in order to correct
>the errors. Meanwhile, the customer does not have the use of his money.
Dead easy with my bank, and no loss of money on amounts in dispute.
>Not all banks will credit back errors, as ACH transactions, unlike credit
>cards, do not have federal requirements that protect the consumer. Banks
>may or may not have policies that mirror credit card regulations.
My bank will. Choose your bank with more care.
>Anyone who hands over power to recipients to remove money from their
>accounts is assuming a lot of risk. There are safer methods of paying one's
>bills.
Depends on the bank.
--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/ Cingu...less_FA
Q>
| |
| Elmo P. Shagnasty 2007-01-30, 7:33 am |
| In article < jvdtr2pedt9a5sedimvr
lbsb375q741ua7@4ax.com>,
John Navas < spamfilter1@navasgro
up.com> wrote:
>
> Nonsense.
Why is it nonsense not to confuse those two dissimilar issues?
Navas, you're amazing. You'd say anything random.
| |
| Elmo P. Shagnasty 2007-01-30, 7:33 am |
| In article < dedtr21n0qlpsag9j8uc
4aah9lo1bo9c24@4ax.com>,
John Navas < spamfilter1@navasgro
up.com> wrote:
>
> Fits my needs better than any other carrier.
And the homeless guys you give ten dollars to fit your XXXXXXX better,
too--but we don't care about those, either.
| |
| Elmo P. Shagnasty 2007-01-30, 7:33 am |
| In article <vNyvh.5500$635.833@trndny05>, "jeremy" <jeremy@nospam.com>
wrote:
> I personally use my bank's online bill payment service, where I authorize
> the date and amount of each payment and where the recipient of the funds has
> no ability to take money out of my account.
>
> Anyone who hands over power to recipients to remove money from their
> accounts is assuming a lot of risk. There are safer methods of paying one's
> bills.
Yep. 100%.
| |
| Kevin K 2007-01-30, 10:33 pm |
| On Tue, 30 Jan 2007 01:18:53 UTC, "jeremy" <jeremy@nospam.com> wrote:
>
> But let's not confuse two dissimilar issues--that of non-availability of
> signal with a culture of contempt for customers.
>
It took me WEEKS to even be able to setup an account with Sprint. At
some point, they had a customer in their system whose SS number was
mine. Most likely a typo, since there hasn't been any evidence of
identity theft. It wasn't even an easy process of just going to a
corporate store, but I had to fill out forms, notarize them, and mail
them in and wait.
So customer service was not a good point for me.
| |
| Edward Reid 2007-01-30, 10:33 pm |
| On Wed, 31 Jan 2007 00:25:43 GMT, Kevin K wrote:
> At
> some point, they had a customer in their system whose SS number was
> mine. Most likely a typo, since there hasn't been any evidence of
> identity theft.
Even more likely, someone didn't want to give out their SSN and picked one
at random, and it was yours.
Edward
--
Art Works by Melynda Reid: http://paleo.org
| |
| jeremy 2007-01-31, 4:33 am |
|
"Kevin K" <kevink4@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:KIRoJuEXw9g9-pn2- WWdWeg10B02d@localho
st...
> On Tue, 30 Jan 2007 01:18:53 UTC, "jeremy" <jeremy@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> It took me WEEKS to even be able to setup an account with Sprint. At
> some point, they had a customer in their system whose SS number was
> mine. Most likely a typo, since there hasn't been any evidence of
> identity theft. It wasn't even an easy process of just going to a
> corporate store, but I had to fill out forms, notarize them, and mail
> them in and wait.
>
> So customer service was not a good point for me.
Not trying to defend Sprint, but they acted to protect themselves from
identity theft. I don't think they intentionally tried to inconvenience
you, unlike Cingular, whose anti-customer tactics are well-documented.
| |
| John Navas 2007-01-31, 10:33 am |
| On Wed, 31 Jan 2007 05:37:25 GMT, "jeremy" <jeremy@nospam.com> wrote in
<pWVvh.2954$q86.1658@trndny01>:
>Not trying to defend Sprint, but they acted to protect themselves from
>identity theft. I don't think they intentionally tried to inconvenience
>you, unlike Cingular, whose anti-customer tactics are well-documented.
Nonsense.
--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/ Cingu...less_FA
Q>
| |
|
| I avoid the hassle of overlooking a payment or not getting a billing a
statement on time by using an automatic charge to my credit card. You can
also set an automatic draft or ach debit to your checking account. Either
way, I never had a problem getting credit for something that I shouldn't
have been billed for.
Marc
"Robert A. Fink, M. D." <lynxer@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:0j6qr2dk0rjnhgg
n54eqjut3gtq57esfr5@
4ax.com...
>I have been a long-time subscriber to Cingular and its predecessors
> (Cellular One, then ATT Wireless, now Cingular, and soon back to ATT)
> and, in general, I have been satisfied with the service. I recently
> signed up with Cingular's Laptop Connect service as well and that has
> also served me well. I also use AT&T for my long-distance and local
> telephone service.
>
> My current complaint with Cingular is its billing policy. I get an
> electronic statement (via e-mail), which gives a payment due date
> about 3 weeks later than the statement, and then, about 10 days later,
> I receive a hard-copy bill which lists a due date about 2 weeks later
> (but the mailed copy does not reach me until less than a week before
> the due date). Then, almost exactly on the due date, I receive
> another hard copy "dun notice" stating that my payment is late! Thus,
> from the day on which I receive the first written bill, I have about
> 2.5 weeks to pay the bill without getting a "late notice". This seems
> a bit "bush league" for someone who has an excellent credit history
> (many years).
>
> Is it too much to expect that one can expect to pay a bill within 30
> days of receipt of the bill and still be considered "on time"? I have
> complained to Cingular and they have not responded. If this
> continues, I will seriously consider switching carriers when my
> current contract ends (less than a year).
>
>
> Best,
>
> Bob
>
> Robert A. Fink, M. D., FACS, P. C.
> Neurological Surgery
> 2500 Milvia Street Suite 222
> Berkeley, CA 94704-2636 USA
> 510-849-2555
>
> "Ex Tristitia Virtus"
|
|
|
|
|