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Cellular forums Home > Archive > Verizon wireless > February 2006 > Re: VOIP horror story (OFF TOPIC)
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Re: VOIP horror story (OFF TOPIC)
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| George,
This is not meant as a criticism, just an observation. I've seen many
stories just like the one you related, and they are not an exaggeration. In
fact, I've witnessed resuscitators save lives, but how they do so reminds me
of a curious fact I've known so long I forgot that most people don't realize
it.
Every year, we have to take a CPR/Resuscitator Refresher course. One year,
the Paramedic giving the course was somewhat of a comedian. The brand of
resuscitator we use is "Heart Start". He made the comment that the equipment
was mis-named.....that actually how they work is thusly;
Serious cardio-events often don't actually STOP the heart, but put it into
a state called "fibrillation", where the heart muscle just quivers instead
of pumping. The defib actually STOPS the heart and "encourages" it to start
beating normally again.
The Medic went on to say that they originally wanted to name the box "Heart
Stop", but someone in the sales department didn't think they'd sell too many
with that name, so "Heart Start" it became.
True story, and quite off-topic, but couldn't resist.
Back on topic, the 911 shortcomings of VoIP are, or should be, quite
well-known at this point. Consumer Reports and other publications take great
pains to point this out when comparing VoIP to landline phone services. 911
accuracy is obviously also an issue in cellphone-land, where AFAIK, a
cellular 911 call will NEVER give a specific address, at most it can tell
which tower received the call, and the area covered by that tower probably
encompasses dozens of square miles (maybe 100?? or more??) so you'd better
know where you are when you dial 911 from the cell.
Dean
____________________
__________________
"George" <george@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
news:hvudnT2iSq9H8WL
enZ2dnUVZ_tqdnZ2d@ad
elphia.com...
> Agent_C wrote:
>
> But vonage 911 doesn't work like "real 911". They were supposed to do it
> but are dragging their feet. "real 911" is what you get on a normal
> landline phone. The call is immediately sent to the proper call center and
> the operator sees your information and in some centers gets a map of your
> location and the locations of emergency vehicles. You could be having a
> heart attack or some other situation where you can't relate any
> information and emergency services will show up. The vonage 911 simply
> connects you (if you provided the info) to a clerical number at the 911
> center and you need to provide your information.
>
> My neighbor is alive today because of "real 911". He came home and felt
> sick. His wife was still out. He dialed 911, had a heart attack and died.
> The paramedics were able to restart his heart. If he had been using vonage
> (or others) his family would have been burying him last year.
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| George 2006-02-25, 5:48 pm |
| Dean wrote:
> George,
>
> This is not meant as a criticism, just an observation. I've seen many
> stories just like the one you related, and they are not an exaggeration. In
> fact, I've witnessed resuscitators save lives, but how they do so reminds me
> of a curious fact I've known so long I forgot that most people don't realize
> it.
>
None taken, I understand what defib does and I did use the word "restart"
> Every year, we have to take a CPR/Resuscitator Refresher course. One year,
> the Paramedic giving the course was somewhat of a comedian. The brand of
> resuscitator we use is "Heart Start". He made the comment that the equipment
> was mis-named.....that actually how they work is thusly;
>
> Serious cardio-events often don't actually STOP the heart, but put it into
> a state called "fibrillation", where the heart muscle just quivers instead
> of pumping. The defib actually STOPS the heart and "encourages" it to start
> beating normally again.
>
> The Medic went on to say that they originally wanted to name the box "Heart
> Stop", but someone in the sales department didn't think they'd sell too many
> with that name, so "Heart Start" it became.
>
> True story, and quite off-topic, but couldn't resist.
>
> Back on topic, the 911 shortcomings of VoIP are, or should be, quite
> well-known at this point. Consumer Reports and other publications take great
> pains to point this out when comparing VoIP to landline phone services.
Most people don't pay attention to this type of stuff and just assume it
works. vonage is especially troublesome because you plug your normal
phones into it so people don't realize something is different. A friend
just got vonage in a house with both kids and an elderly parent and had
absolutely no idea that 911 doesn't work properly using vonage.
911
> accuracy is obviously also an issue in cellphone-land, where AFAIK, a
> cellular 911 call will NEVER give a specific address, at most it can tell
> which tower received the call, and the area covered by that tower probably
> encompasses dozens of square miles (maybe 100?? or more??) so you'd better
> know where you are when you dial 911 from the cell.
>
> Dean
> ____________________
__________________
> "George" <george@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
> news:hvudnT2iSq9H8WL
enZ2dnUVZ_tqdnZ2d@ad
elphia.com...
>
>
>
>
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| On Fri, 24 Feb 2006 23:24:06 GMT, "Dean" <dean173@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Back on topic, the 911 shortcomings of VoIP are, or should be, quite
>well-known at this point. Consumer Reports and other publications take great
>pains to point this out when comparing VoIP to landline phone services. 911
>accuracy is obviously also an issue in cellphone-land, where AFAIK, a
>cellular 911 call will NEVER give a specific address, at most it can tell
>which tower received the call, and the area covered by that tower probably
>encompasses dozens of square miles (maybe 100?? or more??) so you'd better
>know where you are when you dial 911 from the cell.
dean, you're correct about wireless 9-1-1 not providing a specific
address but wireless 9-1-1 calls can provide no data on the caller's
location or some data on the caller's location or a latitide/longitude
plot representing the caller's location. it all depends on several
factors including the technology (or lack thereof) in the caller's
phone, the method of plotting a caller used by the carrier, whether
that method has been implemented in the caller's area and whether or
not the e9-1-1 PSAP (public safety answering point) is equipped to
receive and utilize the data.
wireless 9-1-1 is implemented over four phases. phase 0 means the
call reaches a call center but no data on the caller or the caller's
location is transmitted. the next phase (we called it phase 1/2)
provides the cell tower location and maybe the specific face of the
tower being used. phase 1 provides the caller's callback telephone
number. phase 2 provides phase 1 data along with a map plot.
best case scenario...the caller has a newer phone equipped to transmit
the lat/long thru a carrier that has implemented that solution in the
caller's area to the properly equipped e9-1-1 psap. the e9-1-1
operator receives the call and begins speaking with the caller.
meanwhile, the database retrieves the wireless account owner's name
and callback number. a separate plot of the lat/long data is applied
to a digitized map at the e9-1-1 operator's work station. depending
on factors such as how accurate the map is, is the caller inside a
structure, is the caller inside a moving vehicle, etc. the plot can be
as much as 30 meters off. if you're in the wilds of wyoming that's
not too bad. if you're in downtown chicago 30 meters can be
problematic. the plot will not provide elevation so if you're in a
highrise building or anywhere above the 1st floor you had better tell
the operator.
all of the above is for a GPS equipped phone. the fcc has allowed the
wireless carriers to choose between a GPS (lat/long) solution and what
they call a network solution. the network solution is basically good
old fashioned triangulation. the error with this method can be as
much as 100 meters. but the good news is that phones do not have to
be replaced. before i retired from the biz there were a couple of
carriers considering the network solution but i don't know if they
finalized that or went with a GPS solution.
73,
rich, n9dko
(thankfully retired)
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