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Cellular forums Home > Archive > GPS > August 2006 > wanted question
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| Dave Ferguson 2006-08-27, 12:33 pm |
| Here's an interesting question:
Since all cellphones sold in the US now have gps capability, if the police
were looking for you would they be able to track in on you by the phone?
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| Sam Wormley 2006-08-27, 3:33 pm |
| Dave Ferguson wrote:
> Here's an interesting question:
>
> Since all cellphones sold in the US now have gps capability, if the police
> were looking for you would they be able to track in on you by the phone?
>
>
Is you phone making a call (transmitting)?
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| Sam Wormley wrote:
> Dave Ferguson wrote:
>
> Is you phone making a call (transmitting)?
If turned ON it's transmitting and saying "here I am" to nearby towers. GPS
or no GPS.
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| Jim Townsend 2006-08-27, 3:33 pm |
| Dave Ferguson wrote:
> Here's an interesting question:
>
> Since all cellphones sold in the US now have gps capability, if the police
> were looking for you would they be able to track in on you by the phone?
It's technically possible.
Using radio triangulation between cell towers, they could
track you before GPS started showing up on phones. The
GPS capability is just a lot more accurate.
Not all networks support GPS and I think all phones have
the ability to turn off GPS, so outlaws don't have much
to worry about yet :-)
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|
| Hmmm. Why do you want to know?
Suspiciously wondering,
Eliot Ness
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| GPS25253 2006-08-27, 10:33 pm |
| > Since all cellphones sold in the US now have gps capability, if the police
> were looking for you would they be able to track in on you by the phone?
>
On my cell phone, there is an option to enable GPS only on 911 calls. They
can probably track the area you are in going by what tower your cellphone is
currently connected to. If you are really wanted by the police enough for
them to tap into your cellphone, you shouldn't be using one.
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|
| >Dave Ferguson wrote:
>
>
>It's technically possible.
>
>Using radio triangulation between cell towers, they could
>track you before GPS started showing up on phones. The
>GPS capability is just a lot more accurate.
>
>Not all networks support GPS and I think all phones have
>the ability to turn off GPS, so outlaws don't have much
>to worry about yet :-)
>
AAMOI myself and some of my fellow touring caravanners have used this method as
a cheap form of tracking device in the event their caravan is stolen. While
accidents involving caravans is very small (0.07%) the theft risk in the UK is
very high that's why it costs me almost double the insurance compared with my
car.
One can buy a small GSM device for around £100 that rings up to five mobile
phone numbers in the event it gets triggered by the installed alarm system.
And for a small charged call one can get the location co-ordinates or simply by
using one of the many web based GSM tracking firms one can find out where the
caravan is currently located. However as stated it is nowhere near as accurate
as GPS but in most built-up area's it can pinpoint it down to a few hundred
yards or so, though in countryside area's it can be as much as 4 or 5 miles
depending on the number of masts in the area and signal, so it does have its
limitations for tracking purposes, but it costs virtually nothing to run.
At least it gives the police some idea of the area that the stolen van is
currently located.
Mine usually takes between 4 to 10 seconds for my phone to ring if the alarm
gets triggered, certainly handy if one pulls up on motorway services etc for a
break. Caravans are very easy to steal and insurance companies insist that
hitch locks and wheel clamps are used as a minimum whenever its left un-attended
and is a condition of their insurance.
A proper tracking system will cost anything from £1200 upwards + another £120+
per year.
Many companies use GSM tracking as a cheap alternative, just to keep a check on
the rough location of their drivers etc, though in the UK, the person being
tracked has to give their permission before the phone network can reveal their
location.
Mike
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| Dave Ferguson 2006-08-27, 10:33 pm |
|
"Papa" <bikingis@my.fun> wrote in message
news:iMmIg.10926$Qf.6508@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> Hmmm. Why do you want to know?
>
> Suspiciously wondering,
>
> Eliot Ness
>
>
Just a curiosity question. No, I'm not wanted. Except by my wife. :-)
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"Dave Ferguson" <dvferg@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:8hqIg.2180$xQ1.947@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>
> "Papa" <bikingis@my.fun> wrote in message
> news:iMmIg.10926$Qf.6508@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>
> Just a curiosity question. No, I'm not wanted. Except by my wife. :-)
>
>
Guess we "Untouchables" will let you go this time. ;> )
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| WC Calm 2006-08-28, 4:33 am |
| On Sun, 27 Aug 2006 16:40:14 -0400, "GPS25253" <only@reply.here>
wrote:
>On my cell phone, there is an option to enable GPS only on 911 calls. They
>can probably track the area you are in going by what tower your cellphone is
>currently connected to. If you are really wanted by the police enough for
>them to tap into your cellphone, you shouldn't be using one.
>
Consider that you might have been kidnapped with your cell phone, yet
undetected! Use your imagination...
--
Wayne
"In the future Mr.Calm, you must up your shipments of sand to the sea!"
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| Is it true that all phones in the US have GPS capability, or is the OP
getting confused with GPRS?
GPRS = General Packet Radio Service
GPS = Global Positioning System
AFAIK, it is possible to pinpoint a cellphone's location using GPRS by
triangulation from receivers, but most GPS devices are receivers only that
allow the GPS device to calculate its position from information received
from satellites. Unless a GPS device has a tracking device attached, it can
not be used by a third party to locate the device.
That's my understanding - am I wrong?
Neil
"Dave Ferguson" <dvferg@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:uvkIg.2176$bM.1686@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> Here's an interesting question:
>
> Since all cellphones sold in the US now have gps capability, if the police
> were looking for you would they be able to track in on you by the phone?
>
>
| |
| Dave Ferguson 2006-08-30, 3:33 pm |
|
"Neil" <compo42@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:seednefKmfN8i2n
ZRVnyjQ@bt.com...
> Is it true that all phones in the US have GPS capability, or is the OP
> getting confused with GPRS?
>
> GPRS = General Packet Radio Service
> GPS = Global Positioning System
>
> AFAIK, it is possible to pinpoint a cellphone's location using GPRS by
> triangulation from receivers, but most GPS devices are receivers only that
> allow the GPS device to calculate its position from information received
> from satellites. Unless a GPS device has a tracking device attached, it
can
> not be used by a third party to locate the device.
>
> That's my understanding - am I wrong?
>
> Neil
>
I believe I was correct when I said all phones sold now in the US are
required to have GPS capability.
There are three settings on the phone for this capability: ALI (Assisted
Location information) is set to on. This allows the network to know your
physical location to assist you with driving directions or the location of
the nearest gas station or store. (If you've seen the commercial from Sprint
about "Messing with my Dots" then you know what I'm talking about). My
wife's phone will give turn by turn directions on the Verizon network.
The second setting is "911 only" (where 911 is the common emergency number
in the US). This allows the emergency operator, who has the special
equipment, to locate you and direct emergency services to your location
based on the GPS signal sent by the cell phone.
The third setting is "off" where no signal is sent.
The is why my original post questioned that if you had your phone to either
of the first two settings could law enforcement track you down by your phone
if you are wanted. Or, lets say you are kidnapped and you had a phone your
abducters didn't know you had. Just curious.
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| Wolfgang S. Rupprecht 2006-08-30, 3:33 pm |
|
"Dave Ferguson" <dvferg@mindspring.com> writes:
> The is why my original post questioned that if you had your phone to either
> of the first two settings could law enforcement track you down by your phone
> if you are wanted. Or, lets say you are kidnapped and you had a phone your
> abducters didn't know you had. Just curious.
If the phone's firmware can be upgraded over the air, I think you have
to assume that your settings can be ignored if need be by new
firmware.
The only question I have is does CALEA in conjunction with E911
mandate that the normal firmware hand over the gps position when asked
nicely. Google for CALEA if you haven't heard of it before. In a
nutshell it mandates an automatic wiretap system that gives LEO
realtime, confidential access to phone system data.
-wolfgang
--
Wolfgang S. Rupprecht http://www.wsrcc.com/wolfgang/
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"Dave Ferguson" <dvferg@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:9BlJg.12145$Qf.7179@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>
> "Neil" <compo42@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:seednefKmfN8i2n
ZRVnyjQ@bt.com...
> can
>
> I believe I was correct when I said all phones sold now in the US are
> required to have GPS capability.
>
> There are three settings on the phone for this capability: ALI (Assisted
> Location information) is set to on. This allows the network to know your
> physical location to assist you with driving directions or the location of
> the nearest gas station or store. (If you've seen the commercial from
> Sprint
> about "Messing with my Dots" then you know what I'm talking about). My
> wife's phone will give turn by turn directions on the Verizon network.
>
> The second setting is "911 only" (where 911 is the common emergency number
> in the US). This allows the emergency operator, who has the special
> equipment, to locate you and direct emergency services to your location
> based on the GPS signal sent by the cell phone.
>
> The third setting is "off" where no signal is sent.
>
> The is why my original post questioned that if you had your phone to
> either
> of the first two settings could law enforcement track you down by your
> phone
> if you are wanted. Or, lets say you are kidnapped and you had a phone
> your
> abducters didn't know you had. Just curious.
>
>
Dave
Thanks for your reply. It's interesting that your phones in the States have
this capability - I've never heard of this capability being available on
phones in the UK (although I think one or two may now be appearing with
built in GPS mapping). Raises all sorts of civil liberty type questions
similar to phone tapping etc doesn't it?
Neil
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