Garmin GPS - SIRFIII x series chipset Type G update to version 3 available

Author

SIRFIII x series chipset Type G update to version 3 available

NickTheBatMan

2007-12-02, 3:33 pm

After having this brought to my attention on the GPSMap 60 & 76 Yahoo
groups I've just used the web updater - currently the only way to do
as it can't be found on the Garmin site...

There's no official info but people are mentioning it seems as if
reception and/or processing of WAAS/EGNOS signals has been improved as
well as appearing quicker...

Note that you'll have to turn the GPS off & on and let it get a fix so
that the software reports that it's been updated and the clock then
doesn't show 00:01 1 Jan 07...

Bob S.

2007-12-25, 10:33 pm

On Sun, 2 Dec 2007 12:27:51 -0800 (PST), NickTheBatMan wrote:

>After having this brought to my attention on the GPSMap 60 & 76 Yahoo
>groups I've just used the web updater - currently the only way to do
>as it can't be found on the Garmin site...
>
>There's no official info but people are mentioning it seems as if
>reception and/or processing of WAAS/EGNOS signals has been improved as
>well as appearing quicker...
>
>Note that you'll have to turn the GPS off & on and let it get a fix so
>that the software reports that it's been updated and the clock then
>doesn't show 00:01 1 Jan 07...

I just got a new Vista HCx. How do I know whether it has this new
SiRF software upgrade? If I look at the system setup menu, it tells me
I have "Software Version 2.50" (which I did myself, unit came with 2.40)
and "GPS SW 2.3". Does the "GPS SW" mean that I have the old version?
When I run the updater it tells me "no new updates available".

Dan Anderson

2007-12-25, 10:33 pm

Bob S. wrote:
& #91;snip]
> I just got a new Vista HCx. How do I know whether it has this new
> SiRF software upgrade? If I look at the system setup menu, it tells me
> I have "Software Version 2.50" (which I did myself, unit came with 2.40)
> and "GPS SW 2.3". Does the "GPS SW" mean that I have the old version?
> When I run the updater it tells me "no new updates available".

The "H" models have the MediaTek chipset not the SiRF. I believe
version 2.3 is the current version for the MediaTek.

--
Dan
(Email: dan at domain below )
(www.gpsmap.net)

Bob S.

2007-12-25, 10:33 pm

On Tue, 25 Dec 2007 16:51:42 -0700, Dan Anderson <noEMail@noServer.net> wrote:

>The "H" models have the MediaTek chipset not the SiRF. I believe
>version 2.3 is the current version for the MediaTek.
>

OK thanks. I didn't even know there was a MediaTek chipset... I googled
it and found a review that said that the Mediatek was just as sensitive
as SiRF and consumed 20% less power, so I guess I'm happy...

Did Garmin switch to Mediatek because it's techically better, or was it
a marketing decision (i.e. cheaper for them to buy it etc.) and does
anyone know of any technical drawbacks to this chipset?

Jack Erbes

2007-12-26, 10:33 am

Dan Anderson wrote:
> Bob S. wrote:
> [snip]
>
> The "H" models have the MediaTek chipset not the SiRF. I believe
> version 2.3 is the current version for the MediaTek.
>

And none of the "H" models in the eTrex line list the GPS chip set
version on their software and updates pages.

And none of the "H" model pages list any updates for the MediaTek chip
sets or indicate that updates are or ever will be available.

The software and updates pages for the models using the SiRF III chip
sets (60 and 76 Cx and CSx) do list the GPS chip set version and the GPS
chip set can be updated via WebUpdater or downloads.

Jack

--
Jack Erbes in Ellsworth, Maine, USA (jackerbes at roadrunner dot com)
(also receiving email at jacker at midmaine dot com)

Dan Anderson

2007-12-26, 12:33 pm

Jack Erbes wrote:
> Dan Anderson wrote:
>
> And none of the "H" models in the eTrex line list the GPS chip set
> version on their software and updates pages.
>
> And none of the "H" model pages list any updates for the MediaTek chip
> sets or indicate that updates are or ever will be available.
>
> The software and updates pages for the models using the SiRF III chip
> sets (60 and 76 Cx and CSx) do list the GPS chip set version and the GPS
> chip set can be updated via WebUpdater or downloads.

When I purchased the Vista HCx, it came with an earlier version
(possibly 2.2). Version 2.3 was released and available via WebUpdater.
I waited awhile since I didn't want to risk using WebUpdater but
no update was made available via direct download. Eventually
I gave up and used WebUpdater without any problems (fortunately!!!).

Based on Jack's research it seems to be still only available
via WebUpdater.

I think most of us are very familiar with how up-to-date,
accurate, consistent, listing all pertinent facts, etc. Garmin's
web site is.

--
Dan
(Email: dan at domain below )
(www.gpsmap.net)

Dan Anderson

2007-12-26, 12:33 pm

Bob S. wrote:
> On Tue, 25 Dec 2007 16:51:42 -0700, Dan Anderson <noEMail@noServer.net> wrote:
>
> OK thanks. I didn't even know there was a MediaTek chipset... I googled
> it and found a review that said that the Mediatek was just as sensitive
> as SiRF and consumed 20% less power, so I guess I'm happy...
>
> Did Garmin switch to Mediatek because it's techically better, or was it
> a marketing decision (i.e. cheaper for them to buy it etc.) and does
> anyone know of any technical drawbacks to this chipset?

It's cheaper is certainly a big reason.

The biggest current problem with the MediaTek chipset is too
much filtering/noise level cutoff. If you travel much at less
than 2 mph (3.2 km/hr) the odometer will be wrong. If you
travel much at less than 2 mph the time moving will be wrong
by a significant percentage.

If you travel at less than 1 mph (1.6 km/hr) it won't do
well at all.

The version prior to 2.3 was bad. The update to 2.3
improved the odometer/speed performance in the 1 to 2 mph
range but didn't completely fix it.

If you use it on a bicycle or normally walk 2.5 mph (4 km/hr)
or faster, it will probably give you reasonable values.

Programs can compute those values from the track log.

I have a track log comparison at:

http://www.gpsmap.net/ CompareHikes...76
S.html

--
Dan
(Email: dan at domain below )
(www.gpsmap.net)

Bob S.

2007-12-28, 12:33 pm

On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 10:56:21 -0700, Dan Anderson wrote:

>The biggest current problem with the MediaTek chipset is too
>much filtering/noise level cutoff. If you travel much at less
>than 2 mph (3.2 km/hr) the odometer will be wrong. If you
>travel much at less than 2 mph the time moving will be wrong
>by a significant percentage.
>

That's not good news. I hope they can improve it with more
software updates.

I have a GPSMAP 60CS - not the "H" or the 'x' version, just
the older one from a few years ago, and the odometer and especially
the "time moving" are both usually pretty far wrong when I am hiking
in the forest.

I assumed that this happened because it kept losing lock, and that
the more sensitive receiver would fix this problem by keeping lock
more often.

It looks like this won't be the case though. I guess mothing is
ever perfect... :(

Dan Anderson

2007-12-28, 3:33 pm

Bob S. wrote:
> On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 10:56:21 -0700, Dan Anderson wrote:
> That's not good news. I hope they can improve it with more
> software updates.
>
> I have a GPSMAP 60CS - not the "H" or the 'x' version, just
> the older one from a few years ago, and the odometer and especially
> the "time moving" are both usually pretty far wrong when I am hiking
> in the forest.
>
> I assumed that this happened because it kept losing lock, and that
> the more sensitive receiver would fix this problem by keeping lock
> more often.
>
> It looks like this won't be the case though. I guess mothing is
> ever perfect... :(

Yes, losing lock won't help a receiver give you correct statistics.

I hope it's clear that the MediaTek chipset currently is in the
eTrex models with an "H" for "High Sensitivity" and the SiRF III
is in the 60 and 76 models with an "x" and some other models.
Note that the "x" stands for "eXtended memory" and not the SiRF III.

Here are some samples of the statistics given...

I'm generally stopping frequently to mark waypoints and
take pictures which accounts for most of the difference
in the total and moving times.

A hike with a somewhat faster pace:

Garmin GPSmap 76Cx
-----------------
Trip miles: 10.5 Total time: 5:06
Moving avg: 2.4 Moving time: 4:19
Overall avg: 2.1 Max. speed: 8.1 mph

Garmin GPSmap 76S
-----------------
Trip miles: 10.57 Total time: 5:06:48
Moving avg: 2.4 Moving time: 4:27:05
Overall avg: 2.1 Max. speed: 5.5

Garmin eTrex Vista HCx
----------------------
Trip miles: 10.3 Total time: 5:13
Moving avg: 2.8 Moving time: 3:37
Overall avg: 2.0 Max. speed: 5.8

A hike with a slower pace:

Garmin GPSmap 76Cx
-----------------
Trip miles: 6.20 Total time: 4:55
Moving avg: 1.9 Moving time: 3:15
Overall avg: 1.3 Max. speed: 6.3

Garmin GPSmap 76S
-----------------
Trip miles: 6.26 Total time: 4:57:26
Moving avg: 1.8 Moving time: 3:24:52
Overall avg: 1.3 Max. speed: 5.5

Garmin eTrex Vista HCx
----------------------
Trip miles: 5.23 Total time: 5:06
Moving avg: 2.5 Moving time: 2:03
Overall avg: 1.0 Max. speed: 5.6

Another sample:

Garmin GPSmap 76Cx
-----------------
Trip miles: 9.68 Total time: 6:14
Moving avg: 2.1 Moving time: 4:38
Overall avg: 1.5 Max. speed: 5.9

Garmin GPSmap 76S
-----------------
Trip miles: 10.07 Total time: 6:14:48
Moving avg: 2.1 Moving time: 4:52:36
Overall avg: 1.6 Max. speed: 54.9
(Intermittent WAAS reception results in occasional
extraneous points and adds some distance to trip miles)

Garmin eTrex Vista HCx
----------------------
Trip miles: 8.69 Total time: 6:17
Moving avg: 2.6 Moving time: 3:21
Overall avg: 1.4 Max. speed: 5.8

Another sample:

Garmin GPSmap 76Cx
-----------------
Trip miles: 6.99 Total time: 2:51
Moving avg: 2.6 Moving time: 2:38
Overall avg: 2.4 Max. speed: 4.5

Garmin GPSmap 76S
-----------------
Trip miles: 7.02 Total time: 2:51:57
Moving avg: 2.6 Moving time: 2:42:59
Overall avg: 2.5 Max. speed: 4.7

Garmin eTrex Vista HCx
----------------------
Trip miles: 7.05 Total time: 2:54
Moving avg: 2.9 Moving time: 2:25
Overall avg: 2.4 Max. speed: 5.6

Another sample:

Garmin GPSmap 76Cx
-----------------
Trip miles: 15.9 Total time: 7:57
Moving avg: 2.5 Moving time: 6:15
Overall avg: 2.0 Max. speed: 5.0

Garmin GPSmap 76S
-----------------
Trip miles: 16.30 Total time: 7:57:22
Moving avg: 2.6 Moving time: 6:19:12
Overall avg: 2.0 Max. speed: 81.6
(Intermittent WAAS reception results in occasional
extraneous points and adds some distance to trip miles)

Garmin eTrex Vista HCx
----------------------
Trip miles: 15.8 Total time: 8:00
Moving avg: 3.0 Moving time: 5:16
Overall avg: 2.0 Max. speed: 5.0

--
Dan
(Email: dan at domain below )
(www.gpsmap.net)

Bob S.

2007-12-29, 3:33 pm

On Fri, 28 Dec 2007 12:57:13 -0700, Dan Anderson wrote:

>I hope it's clear that the MediaTek chipset currently is in the
>eTrex models with an "H" for "High Sensitivity" and the SiRF III
>is in the 60 and 76 models with an "x" and some other models.
>Note that the "x" stands for "eXtended memory" and not the SiRF III.
>

yes, thanks.

>Here are some samples of the statistics given...
>
>A hike with a slower pace:

>Garmin GPSmap 76Cx
>-----------------
>Trip miles: 6.20 Total time: 4:55
>Moving avg: 1.9 Moving time: 3:15
>Overall avg: 1.3 Max. speed: 6.3
>
>Garmin eTrex Vista HCx
>----------------------
>Trip miles: 5.23 Total time: 5:06
>Moving avg: 2.5 Moving time: 2:03
>Overall avg: 1.0 Max. speed: 5.6

This is not good, but I usually hike faster than this so hopefully
this won't affect me.

I waited so long to get the new chipset in the Etrex package, and
now I feel like a victim of "bait and switch". I hope they can
fix this with a software update.

Thank you for all your replies, you have been very helpful.

Tom H.

2007-12-29, 3:33 pm

I have not followed this thread from the start, but I hope that at least the
MediaTek chipset gives you the superior reception (inside, under tree cover
etc.) similar to the SiRF III.

Tom

"Bob S." <zxc@gfred.fde> wrote in message
news:4776908b.349453@news.giganews.com...
>
> On Fri, 28 Dec 2007 12:57:13 -0700, Dan Anderson wrote:
>
>
> yes, thanks.
>
>
>
> This is not good, but I usually hike faster than this so hopefully
> this won't affect me.
>
> I waited so long to get the new chipset in the Etrex package, and
> now I feel like a victim of "bait and switch". I hope they can
> fix this with a software update.
>
> Thank you for all your replies, you have been very helpful.
>

Dan Anderson

2007-12-29, 10:33 pm

Tom H. wrote:
> I have not followed this thread from the start, but I hope that at least the
> MediaTek chipset gives you the superior reception (inside, under tree cover
> etc.) similar to the SiRF III.

Yes the MediaTek is similar to the SiRF III in that respect and
possibly even slightly better. IMHO the SiRF III is overall
a better GPS receiver.

--
Dan
(Email: dan at domain below )
(www.gpsmap.net)

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